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Indepth

UN News: Have there been times, therefore, when are poor? Every single one of them?” It’s as if it’s only the poor that face
you’ve had to compromise a bit too much and maybe these sorts of conditions. This is the point that really strikes home that
even let rights campaigners down in some way? time and again: the poor suffer all the consequences. And that for me
was a moment that will always remain with me. And there have been
Zeid Ra’ad Al Hussein: No, not in that sense because I think I’ve quite a few like that.
been outspoken enough and I think I broke new ground when it came
to High Commissioners. I can tell you in almost every meeting I sit with UN News: Is there a specific moment that stands out
governments and I say things that I know they would never have heard as being the most difficult or perhaps even the most
before from someone in the UN. consequential during your tenure?
No, the enormity of the suffering of people creates a feeling of inad-
equacy that, no matter what I do —an interview like this, a press confer- Zeid Ra’ad Al Hussein: It’s all been difficult. When you’re defending
ence, a report — it’s not going to restore a disappeared son or daughter to the rights of people, and there’s so much pressure exerted upon you from
his or her mother. I know it won’t end the practice of torture immediately. this deep inner need or desire to help them, it’s all quite tough.
I know that the residents in an IDP [Internally Displaced Peoples] camp, But I take inspiration from the amazing human rights defenders,
are not going to next day be moved into something more improved. journalists, lawyers, activists in so many countries who do amazing,
And that feeling is the pressure that I’m speaking about. It’s this sort brave things to highlight the plight of others; to defend the rights of oth-
of feeling that no matter what I do, it’s unequal to the colossal challenge ers. Whatever I may want to complain about day in, day out, it’s nothing
that stands before us. compared to the pressure that these people face, confront, overcome
— often they have no fear.
UN News: Have there been times when you thought it These are the real leaders; these are the people that inspire. Not many
best to use quiet diplomacy to work behind the scenes? of the politicians who claim to be leaders and are weak and self-serving,
and are leaders in name only. The real leaders are the ones who, against
Zeid Ra’ad Al Hussein: We’re always trying. We’re always trying all odds, will do the right thing and then often pay a price for it, and be
to use quiet diplomacy. I mean, we’re constantly meeting with govern- detained for it. And I think that’s what keeps us fuelled and working on
ments, and I send letters, and we conduct phone calls. their behalf. Again, the point to be made is that, yes, we are part of the
But on occasion we make a determination that we’ve tried these tracks, UN, but we’re also part of a human rights movement. The UN is creating
it hasn’t worked, and that I’m going to go public. Sometimes, I asked my order amongst States: with us, we look at the heart of the relationship
spokesperson to do it; sometimes, I ask my regional office to do it; and between the governing and the governed and so, of course, it’s going
other times, I’ll do it myself. But it’s carefully thought through. to be sensitive.
There was one foreign minister, for example, I needed to speak to. We Continued on page 42
were planning to send a technical mission to his country and, for almost
a year, he avoided me. I saw him here in the GA [General Assembly] and
he said, “Yes, yes, yes,” and then just avoided me. So then, we got a STUDY IN
message to him that I’m going to go public tomorrow, and he was on

the phone right away. THE UK
And the lesson learned was that if you don’t sometimes threaten to
speak out, you don’t grab their attention. And I would rather err on the A CLASSROOM
speaking out part than staying silent. LIKE NO OTHER
I first worked with the UN in 1994, 1995 in the former Yugoslavia.
And I saw what catastrophes silence can bring. And I think from that
point on, I was determined not to be silent when the evidence before
us was presented. Are you an individual with
demonstrable leadership potential who
also has a strong academic
background?
UN News: What’s touched you most personally in the The Chevening scholarships gives
job? What have been those moments, the encounters leaders’ full support to study for any
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Zeid Ra’ad Al Hussein: There have been many. I think it’s very hard Applications for Chevening
to listen to the suffering of people. One of the times was when I went to Scholarships are now open and will
close on November 6, 2018
the Ilopango detention centre in El Salvador. [Four young women] had Apply at www.chevening.org/apply
been sentenced to 30 years in prison. They claimed these were obstetric
emergencies: miscarriages. The State claimed that these were termina-
tions of pregnancy.
When I sat with them - I had with me a full team, my office, assistants
and interpreters - I think within the space of about 10 minutes we were
all weeping; we were in tears because their suffering was so extreme.
One of them was telling us how her foetus was on the ground and rather
than take her to a hospital, they handcuffed her and took her to prison.
And I thought the cruelty, the capacity for human cruelty is amazing.
I saw the president after that and I said, “Why is it that all these girls

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